All about hand guards

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Re: All about hand guards

Postby evilbarbarianimpaler » 27 Jun 2014 00:20

Dave Long wrote:(PS: it is more likely that the reins are temporarily hooked onto the waist somehow —as in the phrase "riding on the buckle"?— than that they are actually tied around it. Anyone who practices riding with the reins on their belt (we simply drop ours instead) should give some thought to their "quick release" mechanism beforehand, as being tied to your horse's mouth is courting disaster)

After talking to my sister, who does little in actual authentic riding, but she does do allot of mounted sparring, says that if she tucks it into her belt or waistband of her jodhpurs, it's still easy to grab the reins or even for the horse to pull the reins out by natural physics without a problem, but winding a rein around your waist would require a long rein, which to be honest, both of us see it as impractical and stupid on a regular saddle...

In other words, from the queen of trying to do the most stupidest things possible, if she doesn't do it and/or sees it as stupid, there's most likely no good reason to do it, never mind the tempo loss from unraveling the rein..
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Re: All about hand guards

Postby Chiron » 27 Jun 2014 21:21

In other words, from the queen of trying to do the most stupidest things possible, if she doesn't do it and/or sees it as stupid, there's most likely no good reason to do it, never mind the tempo loss from unraveling the rein.

Where's the *like* button.
Sean M wrote:
Chiron wrote:I will second the comment about cavalry needing wider crossguards, short ones the other weapon can just bounce or slide over and then you have a sharp blade wresting on your wrist at < 40kmh, so it helps to have that.

Long Crossguards also allow some really fun techniques from the bind which are also important on horseback.

Yet we have those Cossack sabres with no guard at all, and I think that sharp swords tend to stick to each other where blunt ones will slide. Russ Mitchel's article on techniques which work when two horsemen gallop at each other was educational, and Kinsley's book has a few interesting anecdotes, but I'd be interested to hear from other people who study 18th and 19th century "light" cavalry fencing.

Different strokes for different folks, the steppe cultures used curved weapons and used them differently. If use the blade in circular deflecting motions instead of capturing the blade while keeping your blade on line it makes eliminates the problem.

As far as using a sword and shield on horseback, the tended to leave it slung around the front on a shoulder strap to better use the reins and then if things became a scrum they slipped it onto their arm, it's something that works.
nay king, nay quin we willnae be fooled again!
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Re: All about hand guards

Postby Phil C » 27 Jun 2014 22:21

St Martin has a sabre section on light cavalry versus light cavalry as well as light cavalry versus Hun (and sabre versus pirate which is cool but off-topic) which is very interesting-especially the bit about a leather hand guard and parrying arrow volleys!
Rough translation-
If you direct your circling blows well then your enemy, very often, will give you the position and opening to cut the reins of his horse so that when he must leave the fray he will no longer be in a state of being able to steer.
As for the Hungarian Hussars, who often come to blows with the Turks, Tartars and Circassians who are their natural enemies, when they are attacked by these fellows they often find themselves obliged to change their method of attack and defence.
These Barbarians are in the habit of cutting at the head of their enemies but the movement that they make with their horses, in order to be able to turn their sabre toward the neck of Christians, often makes them miss with this blow, especially with their sabres which are short and curved and do not hit the single point which they aim for that is required to achieve cutting off the head off their enemies.
The Circassian cavalry do the same but they have very sharp sabres.
To parry this attack on must put oneself in the position of prime to better set aside his sabre and riposte with a face blow, coup de Jarnac, circling blow, back cut or a demi-moulinet; by these different methods one will set aside his sabre and entirely expose him.
One can also deter him from approaching too closely with the first position of the charge while making a double moulinet which will prevent them from reaching you with their little sabres and which often even disarms them.
One must make each movement of the moulinet when delivering his blow so that at the same time the Hussar places himself under cover from sabre blows.
It will soon come about that the Tartars will deliver a hail of poisoned arrows. If in a situation such as this the Hussars have a well-padded over-glove, with two little leather lanyards to pass through their hand, and, having garnished the hand thus, they can easily make the double moulinet which will prevent the poisoned arrow from injuring either man or horse; because this moulinet, made with great speed, will gather up all who fall under it.
It will come about fairly often that the Tartar and Circassian horsemen who make up the backbone of the enemy cavalry will seem to be short horsemen lying along their horse, thus he will be covered by the head of his horse.
In a case such as this one must make him raise himself up with circling blows or back-cuts and take advantage of his minimal movements with the use of cuts to the wrist, face or thigh, depending upon which part he exposes first.

Cavalry Attack against Cavalry
One rarely sees two troops of cavalry come to grips without their being a retreat but if the contrary comes about one must always hold the wrist higher than the top of the head with the arm flexible and present the point of the sabre a little lowered toward the enemy, with the edge upwards.
The first sabre blow while attacking the enemy must always be a thrusting blow, the second will be a back cut with a demi-moulinet to the right to deliver him a face blow and at the same time make the same moulinet to the left to deliver him an arm and face blow.
Then return with a flank blow while winding up from right to left and then from left to right.
For the fifth deliver a wrist blow while raising the sabre.
Having pierced the line one must enter between the ranks while making a great double moulinet, going mostly to the fore one must deliver four circling sabre blows which will reach the horseman’s body.
Because one sees that it has been remarked upon how useful it is to make known the parry for each blow that the enemy can deliver; I shall thus make them known.
If upon the first given sabre blow, as has been said previously, the enemy ripostes with an arm blow to the outside I must parry it with a parry of tierce perpendicular, nails low, wrist raised higher than the top of the head.
The riposte for this blow is that of flank. If release an arm blow inside; the riposte for this blow is the parry of quarte with the strong of the sabre, which will riposte with two blows to the face, one to the right, one to the left.
If the enemy delivers a stomach blow one must parry it with prime with the strong of the sabre with the wrist raised higher than the top of the head and with and immediate launching out of the forearm.
The riposte is a neck blow.
The same stomach blow can also be parried by quinte, with the point of the sabre, nails turned outwards the same as the cutting edge, arm flexible and raised to head height.
One ripostes with a face blow to the inside.
If one ripostes with a head blow I parry the blow with a head parry, with the wrist higher than the head, lowered while extended towards the left, edge on top, nails to the outside and the arm a little flexible.
The riposte is a throat blow; one can immediately emerge with a simple moulinet and while lunging out with some circling blows.
From that I have come to show I have demonstrated how the use of moulinets must be necessary in an action of this type.
The moulinet in four directions again becomes very indispensible in its usefulness for an officer or another individual who is in danger of becoming exposed; separated from his troop by some unforeseen event or carried off by his horse, or driven on with little thought or even driven by a desire to distinguish himself he finds himself carried too far into the enemy troop; in this case he will have the presence of mind to make use of the moulinet in four directions, with great speed and force, which will not only parry the blows which are delivered upon him but also reach out and wound his aggressors who, in order to avoid his redoubtable blows, will be obliged to let him go free, especially seeing the very great difficulty that they will experience in trying to reach out with their blows and parry his.
I think have proven well-enough how it is useful and necessary to teach horsemen the method of forming all moulinets well.
--Effete Snob--
"I have a sword to defend my honour. I have a stick to answer those without honour."
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Phil C
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Re: All about hand guards

Postby Chiron » 29 Jun 2014 14:09

Thanks, some absolutely lovely gems in there! :D
nay king, nay quin we willnae be fooled again!
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