Beginner's Guide to Liechtenauer

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Beginner's Guide to Liechtenauer

Postby TheDude » 24 Jul 2007 19:52

I am assembling a Beginner's Guide to Liechtenauer for our new recruits concerning the basic system of German longsword. I am intending on adding a large number of high quality photos (club instructors) to illustrate the techniques etc. The problem I have is which variant or interpretation of the five master strikes to show?

I need a succinct and easy to understand diagram, images and description for each master strike. Who would you recommend for a starting point? The zornhau is pretty straightforward to recreate in clear photos, how about the other four?

Help much appreciated and I will of course post a copy of said document when it is finished on this site.
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Postby bigdummy » 24 Jul 2007 20:07

Theres a pretty good ARMA article on the masterstrikes on their site somewhere, with photos. I found it pretty informative but I'm a dummy.
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Postby TheDude » 24 Jul 2007 20:37

I found the photos on the arma site to be pretty awkward to follow for newcomers, seemed a shame as they spend the time with the descriptions.
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Postby Paul B » 24 Jul 2007 21:58

I suppose the important thing is to get accross what it is that the maisterhau are supposed to accomplish and why.

Other than that, the fechtbuchs I have read seem to go:

Zorn
Krump
Shiel
Zwerch
Sheitel

Must be a reason....
.... or I could be completely wrong.

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Postby Paul B » 24 Jul 2007 21:59

I suppose that is a roundabout way of saying, see how the manuals did it, and copy
.... or I could be completely wrong.

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Postby Paul B » 24 Jul 2007 22:02

ooh, birds eye and reverse angles would be good. Colin Richards' partner sandra came up with a great way of showing techniques in print. Lookfor his fiore book
.... or I could be completely wrong.

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Postby TheDude » 24 Jul 2007 22:49

Trouble with the manuals are they are not 100% clear on how do carry out each of the 5 master strikes. Who's interpretation do we tend to find the most reasonable? Is there any consensus first of all?
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Postby the_last_alive » 24 Jul 2007 23:01

TheDude wrote:Trouble with the manuals are they are not 100% clear on how do carry out each of the 5 master strikes. Who's interpretation do we tend to find the most reasonable? Is there any consensus first of all?


As the handouts are for your class, surely the interpretation should be yours, or that which you follow and teach?
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Postby Fab » 24 Jul 2007 23:58

Get the Ochs DVD !
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Postby TheDude » 25 Jul 2007 10:20

I suppose what might be more useful is for me to put up a separate post with regards to each techniques, such as krumphau. It might then also be useful for everybody else as a discussion point?
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Postby Paul B » 25 Jul 2007 10:22

can... worms....open :twisted:
.... or I could be completely wrong.

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Postby Colin Richards » 25 Jul 2007 10:27

Fab,

You are just so clever!

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Postby Paul B » 25 Jul 2007 11:11

Colin, did you two copyright the timeline layout or can lazy, less inspired folk like me use it in future?
.... or I could be completely wrong.

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Refusal

Postby Jeffrey Hull » 28 Jul 2007 20:24

TheDude wrote:Trouble with the manuals are they are not 100% clear on how do carry out each of the 5 master strikes. Who's interpretation do we tend to find the most reasonable? Is there any consensus first of all?


Firstly, as you imply, not even the historic Masters seem to agree -- they may give differing descriptions of a given stance or movement or strike.

Secondly, I find almost no modern interpretation of Verborgen / Meisterhauen reasonable -- so I refuse to be part of any consensus.
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Postby AdamR » 29 Jul 2007 09:58

How can you assemble a beginners guide if you don't have an opinion on interpretation I wonder?

I think Jeff has a point. Liechtenauer's work is a long process of study and I often find myself discouraging people from trying to 'dip a toe' or' get a feel' unless they really think they want to commit to study it (and when I say 'it' I mean my interpretation of 'it' at any given time!)

Aside from that - you can simply precis the whole art to a sentence or two. Anything more detailed gets suddenly very complicated and requires patient study and would take lots or writing.
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Postby Bill » 20 Nov 2007 15:45

I have a Study Guide that we use at http://www.lukasbruder.org/studyguide.html.
Take a look and see what you think. You are welcome to use what you like in yours just please give credit to everyone I borrowed from as well as what you borrow from me. :lol:
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Postby David Welch » 20 Nov 2007 20:47

Except you have to take the period off the end of "html" :lol:

http://www.lukasbruder.org/studyguide.html
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